First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development CORRECT LINK HERE:
http://www.insideonline.com
/site/epage/55551_162.htm
Thanks to a kind reader for sending in this newsclip about parents at Bell who were protesting a development (here) that could exacerbate overcrowding in the area. Apparently a developer hoping to build 31 townhomes in the Bell School district is willing to pay the school a $300K donation similar to "impact fees" out in the suburbs, to quash the protests against the development and how it will exacerbate crowding at the school. According to the story, this would be a first in CPS (true?). The Bell parents put alderman Schulter on the hotseat. No word on how this all turned out. Anyone know how Schulter voted, or whether this went through already?
Digg
Del.icio.us
Wed Nov 14, 2007 at 2:59 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
I am confused, to the best of my knowledge only slightly over half the students attending Bell live inside the school's boundaries. The school has a regional gifted program that takes students from out side the intake area (possibly up to 23%) the other big bunch of kids in the school's deaf program (21%). By the way the school was built and given to the CPS to educate these deaf students so it would seem our kids have a clear entitlement to attend the school.
So if more families want to move into the community maybe CPS should move out the gifted program. It was nice the developer agreed to the impact fee, but really the out of area gifted program students have no real entitlement to be at the school.
So if more families want to move into the community maybe CPS should move out the gifted program. It was nice the developer agreed to the impact fee, but really the out of area gifted program students have no real entitlement to be at the school.
Wed Nov 14, 2007 at 3:59 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
Really, is that necessary to say that the Gifted students at Bell have to go? I think it's a great school and the gifted kids only make up one class per grade so why kick us out? I love that there are three programs there and there is intergration among the different programs for certain classes like art, music & gym, etc. Bell is a great school with a great community of parents and I would hate to have our program kicked out.
I do not know how it all worked out, but I will add (for those too lazy to look it up) that the parents trying to get the boundaries redrawn are not looking to kick out any current students. The areas we want excluded from Bell's boundaries are currently zoned for industrial use. I signed a petition asking to redraw the boundaries to exclude those areas.
I would hate to see either of the special programs (Deaf or Gifted) go. To be honest, that would make Bell a less desirable place for the neighborhood kids as well.
I do oppose new development in currently industrial zoned areas, though. Bell is not currently at capacity, and there is some room for growth, but not the kind that would support that kind of increase.
I do not know how it all worked out, but I will add (for those too lazy to look it up) that the parents trying to get the boundaries redrawn are not looking to kick out any current students. The areas we want excluded from Bell's boundaries are currently zoned for industrial use. I signed a petition asking to redraw the boundaries to exclude those areas.
I would hate to see either of the special programs (Deaf or Gifted) go. To be honest, that would make Bell a less desirable place for the neighborhood kids as well.
I do oppose new development in currently industrial zoned areas, though. Bell is not currently at capacity, and there is some room for growth, but not the kind that would support that kind of increase.
Wed Nov 14, 2007 at 6:45 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
Bell School according to what we in the deaf community know was built and paid for as a school for deaf students. The intake area was added to the school in an attempt to provide more intergration for deaf students. This made some sense because the number of deaf students have declined in the last 30 years.
But the gifted program was added to the school because the school had room. Now the families of students in the gifted program are trying to limit the intake area to keep the school from being over crowded. The deaf community has long suspected that our children will be next to become part of the over crowding problem. Our children even when experencing inclusion are never included in the gifted program, but rather with the non-deaf students in the neighborhood program classrooms. The gifted students are "too advanced" for our children to keep up with.
There may be a teacher in the gifted program that knows ASL, but I have never seen one. This program has done nothing for our deaf children.
But the gifted program was added to the school because the school had room. Now the families of students in the gifted program are trying to limit the intake area to keep the school from being over crowded. The deaf community has long suspected that our children will be next to become part of the over crowding problem. Our children even when experencing inclusion are never included in the gifted program, but rather with the non-deaf students in the neighborhood program classrooms. The gifted students are "too advanced" for our children to keep up with.
There may be a teacher in the gifted program that knows ASL, but I have never seen one. This program has done nothing for our deaf children.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 2:51 AM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
It would really be interesting to see the Bell endowment for the education of deaf students. My memory says that it's in perpetuity from Alexander Graham Bell himself.
As to exporting the Gifted students, it's been done before. When Burbak housed the northwest quadrant regional gifted center ten years ago, it was becoming overcrowded. So Paul Vallas had the entire Gifted program moved to Beaubien (actually building the Beaubien annex building to make the space). One of the benefits to Beaubien was that the import of nine grades of children who all scored "above average" on the tests (in those days, the ITBS) caused a big jump in the Beaubien test scores, one year to the next.
The only kinky thing about that was that some people up in this part of town (Beaubien is a mile north of where I'm sitting right now) thought the goosed scores came from some local miracle and gave an "outstanding principal" award to the principal. He should have clued them in, but didn't.
At least the corresponding drop at Burbank was not held against the Burbank principal. Both schools adjusted to the changes. So Bell could, theoretically, make the same arrangements if the overcrowding gets too severe.
As to exporting the Gifted students, it's been done before. When Burbak housed the northwest quadrant regional gifted center ten years ago, it was becoming overcrowded. So Paul Vallas had the entire Gifted program moved to Beaubien (actually building the Beaubien annex building to make the space). One of the benefits to Beaubien was that the import of nine grades of children who all scored "above average" on the tests (in those days, the ITBS) caused a big jump in the Beaubien test scores, one year to the next.
The only kinky thing about that was that some people up in this part of town (Beaubien is a mile north of where I'm sitting right now) thought the goosed scores came from some local miracle and gave an "outstanding principal" award to the principal. He should have clued them in, but didn't.
At least the corresponding drop at Burbank was not held against the Burbank principal. Both schools adjusted to the changes. So Bell could, theoretically, make the same arrangements if the overcrowding gets too severe.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 7:03 AM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
So the timeline progression of programs seems to have originated with the hearing impaired program, after which the board allowed for the creation of a neighborhood school program with the adoption of the intake area, and then grew again with the establishment of the gifted program.
For the sake of arguement we can declare that each of the three different student groups currently enrolled into these respective programs has a set of "priority rights" to continue to be enrollled in the school. We can think of these student groups as Current Deaf (C-D), Current Neighborhood (C-N), and Current Gifted (C-G).
We can also think of some different groups of students and assign them priority rights, too. For example, there are the future deaf program students (F-D), the future neighborhood area students (F-N), and the future non-intake area gifted students (F-G). These children range in age from the not yet born to 4 years old and as individual cohorts they may very weill be larger in number than the current students.
Wendy's comment suggest we can subdivide the future intake area students into at least two sub-groups: the future intake area students who currently live in as-built housing units (F-N-Current) and the future intake area students who will likely live in not-yet-built housing units in the industrially zoned properities located within Bell's intake area (F-N-Future). It seems to be a given, by the way, that many if not all of the many industrial zoned properites will be rezoned residential in the coming years.
Wendy suggests that the F-G students' rights should supersede the F-N-Future students' rights, but the developers currently marketing their units as "Bell School" units might argue strongly for the F-N-Future students.
What is interesting about Wendy's suggestion that Bell School would be less desirable (presumably to F-N-Current and Future students) if the F-G students' rights were totally removed, is that a wholesale movement of the gifted program to another less-crowded school (plenty of those nearby) might actually (a) not effect the desirability of Bell whatsoever, and (b) greatly increase the desirability of the nearby neighborhood school that receives the gifted program.
Plenty of different arguments will play out here. About the only thing that seems certain is that there is a clash of rights right around the corner.
For the sake of arguement we can declare that each of the three different student groups currently enrolled into these respective programs has a set of "priority rights" to continue to be enrollled in the school. We can think of these student groups as Current Deaf (C-D), Current Neighborhood (C-N), and Current Gifted (C-G).
We can also think of some different groups of students and assign them priority rights, too. For example, there are the future deaf program students (F-D), the future neighborhood area students (F-N), and the future non-intake area gifted students (F-G). These children range in age from the not yet born to 4 years old and as individual cohorts they may very weill be larger in number than the current students.
Wendy's comment suggest we can subdivide the future intake area students into at least two sub-groups: the future intake area students who currently live in as-built housing units (F-N-Current) and the future intake area students who will likely live in not-yet-built housing units in the industrially zoned properities located within Bell's intake area (F-N-Future). It seems to be a given, by the way, that many if not all of the many industrial zoned properites will be rezoned residential in the coming years.
Wendy suggests that the F-G students' rights should supersede the F-N-Future students' rights, but the developers currently marketing their units as "Bell School" units might argue strongly for the F-N-Future students.
What is interesting about Wendy's suggestion that Bell School would be less desirable (presumably to F-N-Current and Future students) if the F-G students' rights were totally removed, is that a wholesale movement of the gifted program to another less-crowded school (plenty of those nearby) might actually (a) not effect the desirability of Bell whatsoever, and (b) greatly increase the desirability of the nearby neighborhood school that receives the gifted program.
Plenty of different arguments will play out here. About the only thing that seems certain is that there is a clash of rights right around the corner.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 9:53 AM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
You didn't say it, priority rights, but it seems those three groups have weighted rights to Bell, so to speak. Since Bell has an endowment in perpetuity directed to the education of the deaf, current and future deaf students have the most heavily weighted rights to Bell. Next heavily weighted would be the current and future neighborhood students, since Bell is fundamentally a neighborhood school, not a gifted center or classical school, and least weighted would be the gifted students.
Perhaps this would come as a surprise to parents of gifted children, but since the board offers transportation, the program could be housed pretty much anywhere, which isn't true for the other two groups currently sharing Bell.
Perhaps this would come as a surprise to parents of gifted children, but since the board offers transportation, the program could be housed pretty much anywhere, which isn't true for the other two groups currently sharing Bell.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 3:19 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
I don't know of *any* movement to get rid of the Deaf program. If the gifted program gets kicked out, then that would be too bad for us, but please don't misquote me.
I never said that the gifted kids needs outweigh any future neighborhood needs. Actually, the movement to get the industrial zoned areas out of Bell's attendance area is being done almost entirely by current NEIGHBORHOOD parents.
And I am well aware that the school was founded to serve deaf kids needs. I am not suggesting that they be moved. I like the fact that the three programs are integrated whenever possible and that the kids in all programs get to interact with each other at least to some extent. They don't all take math together, but they do take other classes such as music and art together.
I am also aware that if a program goes it will be the gifted program. I just hope that it doesn't come to that because I like the parental community (so far). This is our first year there. I like that we can walk there (we are out of the attendance area only just barely).
Why is it a big deal to want to limit future growth by opposing zoning changes??? Again, this movement is mainly being organized by neighborhood groups.
I never said that the gifted kids needs outweigh any future neighborhood needs. Actually, the movement to get the industrial zoned areas out of Bell's attendance area is being done almost entirely by current NEIGHBORHOOD parents.
And I am well aware that the school was founded to serve deaf kids needs. I am not suggesting that they be moved. I like the fact that the three programs are integrated whenever possible and that the kids in all programs get to interact with each other at least to some extent. They don't all take math together, but they do take other classes such as music and art together.
I am also aware that if a program goes it will be the gifted program. I just hope that it doesn't come to that because I like the parental community (so far). This is our first year there. I like that we can walk there (we are out of the attendance area only just barely).
Why is it a big deal to want to limit future growth by opposing zoning changes??? Again, this movement is mainly being organized by neighborhood groups.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 4:12 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
I'd also like to clarify what I meant by Bell being a less desirable school ... should the gifted program go. A lot of active parents are from this program. Everyone benefits when parents are motived to improve the entire school.
Also, I think we are jumping the gun a bit here. Bell is not overcrowded to the point of kicking anybody out yet.
Also, I think we are jumping the gun a bit here. Bell is not overcrowded to the point of kicking anybody out yet.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 4:31 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
It would seem on the face of it easier to include deaf students in math than in music, certainly at the primary level at any rate. I know that there is a preference to include students with disabilities in specials including PE, because it allows time for self contained teachers to have prep periods. But it is hard for me to think about deaf students being included in a music class without a deaf ed teacher accompanying them and using only an interpreter.
I am a special ed teacher, but not a teacher of the deaf so I do not fully understand the learning characteristics of these students. It seems strange that Bell has inclusion for music for deaf students, but not in math for most of these students at least at the primary level. I do know there are some deaf musicans and composers, but from an educational perspective inclusion in math as opposed to music would seem easier. At any rate I found Wendy's comment interesting.
By the way where I live, in Edgewater, we have supported converting industrial or commerical sites to residential rather than seeing more strip malls, etc. I can get to a Target easy enough and don't need one down the block, so I would rather have town houses. I find it interesting that people in the Bell neighborhood have such a different perspective.
I am a special ed teacher, but not a teacher of the deaf so I do not fully understand the learning characteristics of these students. It seems strange that Bell has inclusion for music for deaf students, but not in math for most of these students at least at the primary level. I do know there are some deaf musicans and composers, but from an educational perspective inclusion in math as opposed to music would seem easier. At any rate I found Wendy's comment interesting.
By the way where I live, in Edgewater, we have supported converting industrial or commerical sites to residential rather than seeing more strip malls, etc. I can get to a Target easy enough and don't need one down the block, so I would rather have town houses. I find it interesting that people in the Bell neighborhood have such a different perspective.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 4:42 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
Well.... I don't know about how much the neighborhood and deaf departments interact in core subjects like math. I do know that the gifted program is separate for all core subjects. That's how they are able to teach at the accelerated rate that they do. Perhaps neighborhood and deaf kids do come together for other subjects.
I know all three groups interact for other subjects that do not meet every day. And it is my understanding (but I could be wrong) that an interpreter and a deaf ed teacher does accompany the deaf kids to these classes. (at least an interpreter does).
Also, for the 5th grade trip (Atwood) and the 8th grade trip (Washington DC) are all inclusive as well.
And all the kids have recess together.
And everyone learns ASL.
Am I really saying anything that warrants hostility? I'm the one posting about being inclusive and everyone else seems to want to kick us out.
I know all three groups interact for other subjects that do not meet every day. And it is my understanding (but I could be wrong) that an interpreter and a deaf ed teacher does accompany the deaf kids to these classes. (at least an interpreter does).
Also, for the 5th grade trip (Atwood) and the 8th grade trip (Washington DC) are all inclusive as well.
And all the kids have recess together.
And everyone learns ASL.
Am I really saying anything that warrants hostility? I'm the one posting about being inclusive and everyone else seems to want to kick us out.
Thu Nov 15, 2007 at 4:49 PM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
"Why is it a big deal to want to limit future growth by opposing zoning changes???"
I don't think it's a big deal to oppose zoning changes. Bell-area families can oppose zoning changes west of Western to their hearts' content. That's not relevant to the point I was making.
I was taking the rezoning of the industrial properties to residential as a given. I was suggesting it would be wrong for any group of parents (neighborhood or gifted) to advocate for the removal of those industrial properties from the Bell area because the children who don't yet live there (but will soon), should have higher priority access to Bell's neighborhood program than the future gifted non-intake area kids.
Wendy is absolutely right when she says that a lot of active parents are from the gifted program, but "everyone" doesn't benefit from this. Certainly the entire Bell school community will not be benefiting from this within a couple of years because this overcrowding problem is about to hit the school, and that is anything but beneficial. If preserving the gifted program means excluding the properties west of Western, than certainly the new buyers of those homes will not benefit from the active parents of Bell's gifted students. Quite the contrary, they (the new parents) will feel ripped off: "What the hell! I moved here so that I can send young Jackson to Bell School. Why was I moved out of the Bell district?". Also, the parents of children in nearby neighborhood schools that might make for a better location for the gifted program are not benefitting either. They could benefit if Bell's gifted program was moved to their school, where there is plenty of space.
This is not an uncommon problem at CPS and these types of problems are not easy to solve. Also, there isn't any jumping the gun here. Bell is not overcrowded now, but now is the only time when something can be done to prevent it.
I don't think it's a big deal to oppose zoning changes. Bell-area families can oppose zoning changes west of Western to their hearts' content. That's not relevant to the point I was making.
I was taking the rezoning of the industrial properties to residential as a given. I was suggesting it would be wrong for any group of parents (neighborhood or gifted) to advocate for the removal of those industrial properties from the Bell area because the children who don't yet live there (but will soon), should have higher priority access to Bell's neighborhood program than the future gifted non-intake area kids.
Wendy is absolutely right when she says that a lot of active parents are from the gifted program, but "everyone" doesn't benefit from this. Certainly the entire Bell school community will not be benefiting from this within a couple of years because this overcrowding problem is about to hit the school, and that is anything but beneficial. If preserving the gifted program means excluding the properties west of Western, than certainly the new buyers of those homes will not benefit from the active parents of Bell's gifted students. Quite the contrary, they (the new parents) will feel ripped off: "What the hell! I moved here so that I can send young Jackson to Bell School. Why was I moved out of the Bell district?". Also, the parents of children in nearby neighborhood schools that might make for a better location for the gifted program are not benefitting either. They could benefit if Bell's gifted program was moved to their school, where there is plenty of space.
This is not an uncommon problem at CPS and these types of problems are not easy to solve. Also, there isn't any jumping the gun here. Bell is not overcrowded now, but now is the only time when something can be done to prevent it.
Fri Nov 16, 2007 at 8:44 AM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
To be honest, I'm not sure which parents were involved specifically to make capital type improvements in the school, I don't want to take away credit from any particular group. But I do know that at least some of them were involved in getting the funds to help with the recent auditorium renovation and the computer lab and many other improvements that benefit the whole school. So don't tell me that active gifted parents don't care about the entire school, I know they do because I know I do.
Fri Nov 16, 2007 at 9:45 AM
First-Ever $300K Impact Fee For Bell Area Development
Who's suggesting that active gifted parents don't care about the entire school? Nobody is saying any such thing.
The question is whether the gifted student parents understand the facts, and the facts suggest that when a neighborhood school such as Bell begins to experience overcrowding, something has to give. These problems are only resolved in one of two ways: Add space or reduce students. The first option costs millions and takes years. The second option, which financially costs nothing and can be accomplished in less than a year, is to phase out Bell's gifted program and start phasing it in somewhere nearby where there is space.
The question is whether the gifted student parents understand the facts, and the facts suggest that when a neighborhood school such as Bell begins to experience overcrowding, something has to give. These problems are only resolved in one of two ways: Add space or reduce students. The first option costs millions and takes years. The second option, which financially costs nothing and can be accomplished in less than a year, is to phase out Bell's gifted program and start phasing it in somewhere nearby where there is space.
By using this service you agree not to post material that is obscene, harassing, defamatory, or otherwise objectionable. District 299 reserves the right to delete or move any material that it deems to be in violation of this rule, and to ban anyone who violates this rule. Reader comments are limited to 500 words.
